The Trinity God
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This information on the Bible can help when cutting and pasting into chat room discussions.
1. General info on the Bible
- The Bible consists of 66 books: 39 in the OT and 27 in the new. The Bible took about 1600 years to write. It was written in three languages (Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek) by about 40 authors and is internally consistent throughout.
2. Reliability of the Bible
- The Bible is 98½ percent textually pure. Through all the copying of the Biblical manuscripts of the entire Bible, only 1½% has any question about it. Nothing in all of the ancient writings of the entire world approaches the accuracy of the biblical documents.
- The 1½ percent that is in question does not affect doctrine. The areas of interest are called variants and they consist mainly in variations of wording and spelling.
- The NT has over 5000 supporting Greek manuscripts existing today with another 20,000 manuscripts in other languages. Some of the manuscript evidence dates to within 100 years of the original writing. There is less than a 1% textual variation in the NT manuscripts.
- Some of the supporting manuscripts of the NT are:
- John Rylands MS written around 130 A.D., the oldest existing fragment of the gospel of John
- Bodmer Papyrus II (150-200 A.D.)
- Chester Beatty Papyri (200 A.D.), contains major portions of the NT
- Codex Vaticanus (325-350 A.D.), contains nearly all the Bible.
- Codex Sinaiticus (350 A.D.), contains almost all the NT and over half of the OT
3. Prophecies of the Bible
- Odds of Jesus filling the prophecies:
* The odds of Jesus fulfilling 48 of the 61 major prophecies concerning Him are 1 in 10157; that is a one with 157 zeros behind it. By comparison, the estimated number of electrons in the entire known universe is about 1079; that is a one with 79 zeros behind it.
- Prophecies of the Bible
- Virgin Birth Prophecy
* Isaiah 7:14, "Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel."
- Note: the Jews who translated the Septuagint (Greek Translation of the Hebrew Old Testament) translated Isaiah 7:14 as the word virgin, not young maiden.
- Matt. 1:18,25, "This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary...was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit... But he had no union with her until she gave birth to a son. And he gave him the name Jesus."
- Born in Bethlehem
. Micah 5:2 "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times."
- Matt. 2:1, "After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem."
- Preceded by a messenger
* Isaiah 40:3, "A voice of one calling: 'In the desert prepare the way for the LORD; make straight in the wilderness a highway for our God.'"
- Matt. 3:1-2, "In those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the Desert of Judea and saying, 'Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near.'"
- Side Pierced
* Zech. 12:10, "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one mourns for an only son."
- John 19:34, "Instead, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus' side with a spear, bringing a sudden flow of blood and water."
* Psalm 22:16-18, "a band of evil men has encircled me, they have pierced my hands and my feet. I can count all my bones; people stare and gloat over me. They divide my garments among them and cast lots for my clothing."
- Luke 23:33, "When they came to the place called the Skull, there they crucified him, along with the criminals -- one on his right, the other on his left."
- John 19:33, "But when they came to Jesus and saw that He was already dead, they did not break His legs."
- John 19:23-24, "When the soldiers crucified Jesus, they took his clothes..they said to one another. "Let's decide by lot who will get it." This happened that the scripture might be fulfilled which said, "They divided my garments among them and cast lots for my clothing." So this is what the soldiers did."
4. Scientific Accuracies in the Bible
- The spherical shape of the earth (Isaiah 40:22).
- The earth is suspended in nothing (Job. 26:7).
- The stars are innumerable (Gen. 15:5).
- The existence of valleys in the seas (2 Sam. 22:16).
- The existence of springs and fountains in the sea (Gen. 7:11; 8:2; Prov. 8:28).
- The existence of water paths (ocean currents) in the seas (Psalm 8:8).
- The water cycle (Job. 26:8; 36:27-28; 37:16; 38:25-27; Ps. 135:7; Ecc. 1:6-7).
- The fact that all living things reproduce after their own kind (Gen. 1:21; 6:19).
- The nature of health, sanitation, and sickness (Gen. 17:9-14; Lev. 12-14).
- The concept of entropy, that energy is running down (Psalm 102:26).
God as a Trinity
- God is the only Supreme Being in all existence, places, and time. He is Holy (Rev. 4:8), Eternal (Isaiah 57:15), Omnipotent (Jer. 32:17,27), Omnipresent (Psalm 119:7-12), Omniscient (1 John 3:20); etc.
- He is Love (1 John 4:8,16); Light (1 John 1:5); Spirit (John 4:24); Truth (Psalm 117:2); Creator (Isaiah 40:12,22,26), etc.
- He is to be worshiped (Gen. 24:26; Exodus 4:31; 2 Chron. 29:28; 1 Cor. 14:25; Rev. 7:11).
- Christianity is monotheistic - Only one God in existence, anywhere, anytime. See Isaiah Isaiah 43:10; 44:6,8; 45:5,14,18,21,22; 46:9; 47:8; John 17:3; 1 Cor. 8:5-6; Gal. 4:8-9 for verses that teach monotheism.
- The Trinity is one God who exists simultaneously in three persons. Each is coequal, copowerful, and coeternal with the other. Each person, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, is not the other. Without either there is no God; all comprise the one God.
- Analogy of the Trinity: With time, for example, the past is distinct from the present, which is distinct from the future. Each is simultaneous. Yet, they are not three 'times,' but one. That is, they all share the same nature: time
- Trinitarian Verses
- Matt. 28:18, "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,"
- 1 Cor. 12:4-6, "Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. 6And there are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons."
- 2 Cor. 13:14, "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all."
3. Objections to the Trinity answered
- The Word Trinity is not in the Bible.
- Just because the word trinity is not in the Bible doesn't mean that the concept is not taught. The word monotheism is not in the Bible, yet the Bible teaches it (Isaiah 43:10; 44:6,8). Therefore, your criticism is invalid.
- The Trinity is illogical
- What law of logic is it that the doctrine of the Trinity violates? If you cannot tell me, then your statement is meaningless. Saying it is illogical does not mean it is.
- The Trinity is pagan
- Saying it is pagan means nothing. The question is whether or not it is biblical. Are there verses that show that the F., S., & H.S. are each God, each indwell, each have a will, each loves, etc.? Yes there are.
- The F., S., & H.S. are each called God (F., Phil. 1:2), (S., John 1:1,14; Col. 2:9), (H.S., Acts 5:3-4). Each has a will (F., Luke 22:42), (S., Luke 22:42), H.S., (1 Cor. 12:11). Each is all knowing (F., 1 John 3:20), (S., John 16:30; 21:17), (H.S., 1 Cor. 2:10-11), etc.
- Regarding the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Each has a will (F., Luke 22:42), (S., Luke 22:42), H.S., (1 Cor. 12:11). Each speaks (F., Matt. 3:17), (S., Luke 5:20., (HS., Acts 8:29; 13:2).
- The Trinity came from pagan trinities.
- There are no trinities in pagan theology. There are triads (three gods), but no trinities (one God in three persons). Therefore, your statement is inaccurate.
- The Bible does not say that God is three who's and one what.
- That is correct. But the Trinity is a doctrine arrived at systematically (by looking at the whole of scripture), not by looking at a single verse. Therefore, your complaint is misdirected and shows you don't understand the Trinity.
- Show me one verse in the Bible that says that God is three persons.
- The Trinity doctrine is arrived at systematically (by looking at the whole of scripture), not by looking at a single verse. Therefore, you won't see a single verse that says it. Also, this demonstrates that you don't understand the Trinity, otherwise you would not have asked that question.
1. Jesus, Who is He?
- Jesus has two natures at the same time: divine and human at the same time. He is both God and man (John 1:1,14; Col. 2:9). This is called the Hypostatic Union.
- Jesus was born of the virgin Mary (Matt. 1:18; Luke 1:35).
- "He was born under the Law (Gal. 4:4) and fulfilled all of the Law of God (John 4:34 ; 8:29), even to the point of death (Phil. 2:8).
- In His death He bore the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us (Gal. 3:13). Thus in the death of Christ the sins of His people were judged (Rom. 3:23-26) and forgotten (Heb. 8:12), and the result of His act of righteousness was eternal life (Rom. 5:18).
- Jesus is worshiped - (Matt. 2:2,11; 14:33; John 9:35-38; Heb. 1:6).
- Jesus is prayed to - (Acts 7:55-60; Psalm 116:4 with 1 Cor. 1:1-2).
- Jesus is called God - (John 20:28; Heb. 1:8).
- He is the creator (John 1:1-3; Col. 1:15-17); Jesus is uncreated (John 1:1-3; Col. 1:15-17).
2. Verses showing Jesus is divine
- He is God in flesh (John 1:1,14; 8:58 with Exodus 3:14; Col. 2:9; Phil. 2:5-8; Heb. 1:8).
- John 1:1,14 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God...14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us..."
- This shows that Jesus is God in flesh.
- If you say that John 1:1 should be "a" god, then...
- If Jesus is "a" god, then isn't that polytheism?
- If Jesus is "a" god, then how many gods are their in JW theology?
- If Jesus is "a" god, then is he a true God or false god since the Bible says there is only one God (Isaiah 43:10; 44:6,8)?
- If Jesus is "a" god, then why does he tell people to come to him and not the Father (Matt. 11:28)?
- John 8:58, "Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am." With Exodus 3:14 "God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.'"
- Jesus uses the same title for Himself that God uses of Himself.
- If you say that the verse is really, "I have been", then why did the Jews want to kill him -- especially when in John 10:30-33 they say they want to kill Him because He claimed to be God? Where and what did Jesus say to cause them to think that?
- John 20:27
* In John 20:27 Thomas called Jesus God by saying to Jesus, "My Lord and My God". If Jesus is not God, then why did Jesus did not correct Thomas. Four verses later, it says that this is written so you might believe that Jesus is the son of God, (John 20:31). Therefore, we can see that the term Son of God is saying that Jesus is God.
- Col. 2:9, "For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form,"
- Phil. 2:5-7, "Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, 7 but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness."
- Heb. 1:8, "But of the Son He [The Father] says, "Thy throne, O God, is forever and ever..."
* If Jesus is not God, why does God Himself call Jesus God in Heb. 1:8?
- This is a quote from Psalm 45:6 which has the best translation of "Thy Throne O God..."
3. Other Verses
- John 10:30-33,"I and the Father are one." 31The Jews took up stones again to stone Him. 32Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?" 33The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
* Notice the Jews said, "You being a man, make yourself out to be God." What did Jesus say that caused the Pharisees to say that Jesus was claiming to be God in John 10:30-33. If you don't know, then you don't understand.
- Regarding John 10:30-33, if you deny that Jesus is God in flesh, then you are agreeing with the Jews who killed Christ because they did not accept who He really was.
- Col. 1:15-16, "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him."
* Firstborn is a transferrable title and does not necessitate being first created. Proof of this can be seen where Manasseh is the first born (Gen. 41:51-52 and then his brother Ephraim is called the firstborn (Jer. 31:9).
- Gen. 41:51-52, "And Joseph called the name of the first-born Manasseh: For, said he, God hath made me forget all my toil, and all my father's house. And the name of the second called he Ephraim: For God hath made me fruitful in the land of my affliction."
- Jer. 31:9, "...for I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is My firstborn."
- 1 Cor. 1:2, "To the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy, together with all those everywhere who call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ-their Lord and ours."
* Why is the phrase "Call upon the name of the LORD" (Hebrew, YHWH, i.e., Psalm 116:4) used only of God on the OT, and translated into the Greek in the LXX as "Call upon the name of the LORD (greek, KURIOS)," applied to Jesus in the NT (1 Cor. 1:2) if Jesus is not God in flesh?
- The LXX is the septuagint which is the Greek translation of the Hebrew Old Testament done by Jews around 200 B.C.
- Psalm 116:4, "Then I called upon the name of the Lord [YHWH]: "O Lord [YHWH], I beseech Thee, save my life!"
- The literal translation of 1 Cor. 1:2 is "...call upon the name of the Lord of us Jesus Christ."
4. The Resurrection of Christ
- Jesus rose in the same body that He died in (John 2:19-21; Luke 24:36-43). Jesus' body is 'resurrected.' We do not know exactly what His body is like, but the nature of the resurrected body is discussed by Paul in 1 Cor. 15:35-58.
* John 2:19-21, "Jesus answered them, "Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days." 20 The Jews replied, "It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and you are going to raise it in three days?" 21 But the temple he had spoken of was his body."
- Luke 24:39, "Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have."
- Right now Jesus is in heaven, still as, and eternally to be both God and man (1 Tim. 2:5; Col. 2:9).
* This is important because Jesus is the High Priest forever: "where Jesus has entered as a forerunner for us, having become a high priest forever according to the order of Melchizedek," (Heb. 6:20). A spirit cannot be a high priest, only a man can do that. Furthermore, Jesus always lives to make intercession for us "Hence, also, He is able to save forever those who draw near to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them," (Heb. 7:25).